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Thread: Disable Neural Network

  1. #1
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    Exclamation Disable Neural Network

    im tuning a dodge charger 2010, and disabling the neural network to modify the ve tables and nothing change with the A/F.
    Help please?
    Q8 & Gulf Countries Hptuners

  2. #2
    SO you did disable the ANN? If you did then it sounds like the perimeter might be mapped wrong.

  3. #3
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    yes sir i did but there is no change effect when changing the VE table, Can you please help me .
    Q8 & Gulf Countries Hptuners

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moparking View Post
    SO you did disable the ANN? If you did then it sounds like the perimeter might be mapped wrong.

    yes sir i did but there is no change effect when changing the VE table, Can you please help me .
    Q8 & Gulf Countries Hptuners

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Super Shop View Post
    yes sir i did but there is no change effect when changing the VE table, Can you please help me .
    Please e-mail support and attach your tune file. And please link to this thread.
    Last edited by Bill@HPTuners; 01-05-2016 at 05:16 PM.

  6. #6
    Advanced Tuner uarperformance's Avatar
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    Do not disable neural network. Injector scaling is the proper way.

  7. #7
    Senior Tuner Mep_q8's Avatar
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    injector scaling is the old school way of tuning for commanded.. (Alot of "Branded" ford tuners still do this coz its the easy way)

    It would be good to get the VE trims in set, that way you have command of every moment the engine is running.

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  8. #8
    Advanced Tuner uarperformance's Avatar
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    The Neural network in these cars does not work anything like a Ford. These cars are totally different. The VE tables do not follow percentages and will throw trims all over the place. Will work one day and not the next. It is a very very Complex system!

  9. #9
    Advanced Tuner uarperformance's Avatar
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    Fuel enrichment is the fine tuning. This is on VVT cars, older non VVT cars can use VE tables and definitely the proper way to tune them.

  10. #10
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    Let them disable it and learn themself. It was told 100 times and they dont believe that disabling is the wrong way with the given options to tune.

  11. #11
    Advanced Tuner uarperformance's Avatar
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by monty007 View Post
    Let them disable it and learn themself. It was told 100 times and they dont believe that disabling is the wrong way with the given options to tune.
    Maybe you could provide some insight, instead of just telling everyone it's wrong.

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    Would be helpful to understand what mods were done that is creating the need for tuning.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by uarperformance View Post
    The Neural network in these cars does not work anything like a Ford. These cars are totally different. The VE tables do not follow percentages and will throw trims all over the place. Will work one day and not the next. It is a very very Complex system!
    I've not found this to be the case with ANN switched off and VE calibrated properly.

  15. #15
    Advanced Tuner uarperformance's Avatar
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    The neural network is above my head on how the ECM makes the calculations. I have try to study it and would take some very complex equipment to truly data log and make satisfactory adjustments requiring many many HRS. Do to the fact that the ECM VVT has to make such fast adjustments, it actually makes the adjustments before the event happens and cks to make sure it did it correctly. Since it is not a mass airflow it takes tons of time to write the software because it is relying on math calculations that are above most I tried to load the formulas but it is too big. I can email it to whoever and see if they get a better grasp of it

  16. #16
    Senior Tuner Mep_q8's Avatar
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    All forced inducted mopar vehicles I tune, I tune with Neural Network disabled.

    Alas the stock VE table in HP Tuners needs to be adjusted, but thats the reason we tune cars.

    IF as said above, fuel trims alter on a daily basis, that also means you are keeping Barometric pressure adapt active, which would definitely change the fuel trims although you did spend hours tuning a VE table one specific day.

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  17. #17
    Advanced Tuner uarperformance's Avatar
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    VE tables absolutely do no not respond to percentage changes. If remove or ADD 5 % from the VE table on neural network it will not move 5%. so you are guessing what your target is

  18. #18
    Advanced Tuner uarperformance's Avatar
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    I tried on the last 3 2015s and none of them responded to VE percentage and trims do not follow. It is a multi tier calibration. Can you explain to me the way the neural network works than?

  19. #19
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    I'm wondering why the original poster hasn't chimed back in after talking with support?

  20. #20
    Senior Tuner Mep_q8's Avatar
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    That sounds very weird.. You should know in order for the fuel trims on the mopar ecus to update it does take a good amount of time unless you have the starscan tool where you can reset them..

    Bader Norris
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