Caliber SRT Short/Long Term Adaptives?

[csrt357]

Sure this has been covered many times over many diff chassis/platform from the same generation and same PCMs (NGC/Siemens), I had the car tuned recently (couple weeks ago) on HPT, no running issues so far. The annoying part is the memory adaptives, if I understand them correctly from the limited info of my research on them, these are complicated algorithms that "basically" will alter fuel/ignition parameters to enhance fuel economy on these generation of Chryslers after "x" amount of key cycles? Its quite frustrating to have to source a dealer level/high end scan tool to be able to reset adaptives to enjoy the power the car actually is capable of!!!

My question being, is this something many other Chrysler product owners and I will have to suffer with for the life of these cars? Or is there something I can have my tuner do/disable/enable to prevent from having to reset PCM memory every month or so? If possible, is there any negative consequences from doing such other then say poor MPG maybe? Sucks smacking the throttle randomly one day while cruising around and you have a solid 100whp less then the car was tuned for!!!

Does anyone else have anymore info on these memory adaptives they could chime in with, whether it be personal experience or theory or informational?

p.s.
car does seem to have a constant/annoying oscillation or almost like bucking sensation when part throttle in low gears approaching 0 vac, me and the tuner couldn't duplicate when I was in town after the tuning session, anybody had experience with this from the Calibers? I know DSP released a revised tune for the caliber guys to fix this when they released the intune.

[06300CSRT8]

So do you have HP Tuners downloaded and have the hardware to scan the car? You should post up your tune file and a log of the bucking. I wasn't aware of some hardcoded algo that makes your fuel trims adjust regardless of what they are seeing (they will adjust to the tune being off and eventually be relearned). I personally have a similar issue where my cam has pretty high overlap and is nearly impossible for the 02 sensors to read correctly and so my fuel trims get learned incorrectly. The result is lots of bucking and surging. I just simply run my car with the 02 sensors disabled, aka speed density mode. To do so though, you need to do some further tuning to ensure your VE tables are pretty much spot on, otherwise you may face new drivability issues.

To get this fixed we really need a copy of the tune and log, otherwise kind of stuck here.

[csrt357]

Yea I figured as much, I dont have access to any of that unfortunately so I assume im stuck up shits creek without a paddle for now.

Its annoying though, ive brought the car in fresh off the street from normal driving, strapped it down with all same settings and it will put down like 260-270hp/300-330tq, clear adaptives (long and short) and nothing else changed or adjusted do another pull and make true numbers to what the car was dyno'd at 350-360hp/360-370tq.....duplicated it many times as well lol

[06300CSRT8]

You should look into an aeroforce gauge, believe you can reset fuel trims right on the gauge.

[csrt357]

You should look into an aeroforce gauge, believe you can reset fuel trims right on the gauge.

True now that you mention that, I remember that they offer adaptive resets through the interceptor. I was just curious if thru the HPT software there was a way to disable adaptive learning.

[B00STJUNKY]

I'm assuming there is more to it than simply the adaptive fuel trims causing such a difference in power? I mean there has to be some trimming in timing and possibly other areas to cause a 100 whp difference. Is the PCM controlling boost on the car, and if so, is it gradually dropping the amount of boost that is being made?

Do you have a log of what your trims look like at WOT? I'd be curious to see just how much trimming is being done in regards to fueling. Do you have a wideband installed, and if so, is the AFR reading changing drastically between the time adaptive trims have taken their toll, and the time you reset the adaptives?

[csrt357]

WOT fuel trims via the wideband are consistent usually (-.2+). Before the tune I noticed that WOT fuel on the wideband was showing slightly lean (11.9-12.2), I attributed that to small component changes I made (downpipe/intercooler). I need to purchase a VCM suite, but my tuner has the license to my VIN so ill have to contact him. Is there anyway he can send a copy of the tune to me for viewing only?

[06300CSRT8]

Yes your tuner can send you a copy of your tune just for viewing. I believe you can read, edit, flash your PCM once you purchase VCM regardless if your tuner has already tuned your car.

Did you really mean .2 fuel trims? That's next to nothin, if you said it was adding 25% fuel I could see the power loss, based on a 100whp diff I'd say it's prob more knock, throttle body closing due to air limit, or cat over temp

[csrt357]

Yes your tuner can send you a copy of your tune just for viewing. I believe you can read, edit, flash your PCM once you purchase VCM regardless if your tuner has already tuned your car.

Did you really mean .2 fuel trims? That's next to nothin, if you said it was adding 25% fuel I could see the power loss, based on a 100whp diff I'd say it's prob more knock, throttle body closing due to air limit, or cat over temp

Sorry for the late replies, and thank you for your input so far, I will request a copy of the tune for view from my tuner and drop it in here.

I have monitored throttle % on scan tool during WOT, and its a consistent 85-86% never pulls, I need to find a good knock PID to view and report back.

[06300CSRT8]

Sorry for the late replies, and thank you for your input so far, I will request a copy of the tune for view from my tuner and drop it in here.

I have monitored throttle % on scan tool during WOT, and its a consistent 85-86% never pulls, I need to find a good knock PID to view and report back.

There are 4 different throttle % in your PCM

-Accelerator Position (your actual pedal % of total voltage (5v))
-Commanded Throttle Actuator (commanded % converted to what throttle body opening % that power request equates to, aka "predicted")
-Relative Throttle Position (I believe this is your transient pedal position, while NOT in pedal follower mode)
-Throttle Position (actual throttle body opening)

Sounds like you are logging throttle position, which is good, but would be nice to see the others to figure out where it is trying to pull power.