Gen1 Swapped f100 with Gen3 Whipple issues

[konabluekiller]

I will start off with I am very new at tuning the supercharged applications, and this is my first Whipple to do from scratch. Vehicle is a 69 F100 with a gen1 5.0, and trimmed stock harness swapped into it. Has a Whipple 2.9 Gen3 with the 132mm Throttle body and 3.75 pulley. I modified the tune (a few different variations) and am having trouble. It is not a whipple OS, I just went through and changed the things I needed for boost, injector data, TB and MAF data and whatnot to get it to run. It does start and run and idle decent, but when O2 sensors come on its wanting 52 percent more fuel and reading very lean. I have tried to send a tune with 50 percent more fuel in the MAF transfer function but it makes it run worse and doesn't help the issue. At first I thought it was because he had short exhaust after the o2 sensors and they were getting extra air from the short pipe, but today he sent me a log with full exhaust and its doing the same thing.

OEM Whipple Maf and Throttle change and torque table tweaks.hpt
nickidlemay.hpl

[konabluekiller]

Also to add, I cannot find a known good Whipple OS tune for a gen 1 platform. Seems they are all for gen 2

[Relentless]

What are you using for a Fuel system?

I believe you are overstating your boost on Calc MAP Max Delta above BP. I think you estimated it with barometric pressure added.

Also you only seemed to load up to 35 degrees on your TB, looks like the calcs are accurate for the angle though.

Your stoich looks like you are using E85?

Defiantly need more information on your build though. I am no expert but i hope it can give you another set of eyes, I know how frustrating this can be.

[konabluekiller]

E85
Boost referenced regulator 1 to 1
And yes any help is much appreciated... those things I changed maybe was something on a whipple tune I saw and changed without knowing.

[Relentless]

E85
Boost referenced regulator 1 to 1
And yes any help is much appreciated... those things I changed maybe was something on a whipple tune I saw and changed without knowing.

I think your fuel pump settings need to be adjusted for the return style. so your Fuel Pump>inferred rail pressures should be changed to what your injector pressure will be. usually ~55psi for a 4 bar and ~39psi for a 3 bar.

Also your knock timing retard is only active from 5500-8000 rpm. I would want knock control down to 750 rpm.

I would try loading the data for your MAF and TB and then dial them both in with logs. I would normally like to start a tune on gas and move to E85 after as there is a lot more information out there to guide you for a gas tune and then transfer to E85. Make sure your timing is set for gas if your timing is advanced for E85. I see Flexfuel on your tune so you might have the ability to do a flexfuel tune so you can run either fuel.

This is the data for the TB that i have found on the forums.
132mm Throttle Bodie.png
132mm Throttle Bodie.png


Hopefully this can get you started, good luck!

[Relentless]

Forgot to mention mechanical issues. Have you cut or extended your O2 sensors? and have you ruled out Vac leak or exhaust pulling in fresh air to the O2 sensors? obviously there is a lot of potential for a mechanical issues.

[konabluekiller]

I think your fuel pump settings need to be adjusted for the return style. so your Fuel Pump>inferred rail pressures should be changed to what your injector pressure will be. usually ~55psi for a 4 bar and ~39psi for a 3 bar.

Also your knock timing retard is only active from 5500-8000 rpm. I would want knock control down to 750 rpm.

I would try loading the data for your MAF and TB and then dial them both in with logs. I would normally like to start a tune on gas and move to E85 after as there is a lot more information out there to guide you for a gas tune and then transfer to E85. Make sure your timing is set for gas if your timing is advanced for E85. I see Flexfuel on your tune so you might have the ability to do a flexfuel tune so you can run either fuel.

This is the data for the TB that i have found on the forums.
132mm Throttle Bodie.png
132mm Throttle Bodie.png


Hopefully this can get you started, good luck!

On the knock sensors, some of this was copied from another tune I had on my coyote swapped FC RX7. I was going to go through and change some of that once we got the truck idling and stuff. Changing the rail pressure stuff now, which is weird because my rx7 wasn't changed and it was return style. And it always ran fine

[konabluekiller]

Forgot to mention mechanical issues. Have you cut or extended your O2 sensors? and have you ruled out Vac leak or exhaust pulling in fresh air to the O2 sensors? obviously there is a lot of potential for a mechanical issues.

He said o2 harnesses are stock, and the exhaust is finishes fully now with no leaks, and also said he had fixed the vacuum leak before this log.

[konabluekiller]

I think your fuel pump settings need to be adjusted for the return style. so your Fuel Pump>inferred rail pressures should be changed to what your injector pressure will be. usually ~55psi for a 4 bar and ~39psi for a 3 bar.

Also your knock timing retard is only active from 5500-8000 rpm. I would want knock control down to 750 rpm.

I would try loading the data for your MAF and TB and then dial them both in with logs. I would normally like to start a tune on gas and move to E85 after as there is a lot more information out there to guide you for a gas tune and then transfer to E85. Make sure your timing is set for gas if your timing is advanced for E85. I see Flexfuel on your tune so you might have the ability to do a flexfuel tune so you can run either fuel.

This is the data for the TB that i have found on the forums.
132mm Throttle Bodie.png
132mm Throttle Bodie.png


Hopefully this can get you started, good luck!

Also, i dont have enough cells to copy over that throttle data to the gen 1 pcm. Trying to figure out what i should do with that or if i should scale it

[konabluekiller]

Does anyone have a whipple tune for a gen1 platform?

[Relentless]

If you are having trouble with the TB data, you can cherry pick. I would try to do it evenly and try to pic more data points by detailed area where an interpolation won’t work well.

[konabluekiller]

I did that, sortof scaled it to fit. Still fighting some MAF transfer stuff because i dont think the one i used matches his maf diameter. Just wish someone would post a base whipple file for a gen 1... i have tons for gen2 but its not similar

[HextallS550]

For a Copperhead ECU from a Mustang with a Whipple you should use data from the 13-14 or 16 Cobra Jet program for most of your sensors. That data was done in a lab at Ford and/or Roush facilities. Not sure what you’re running for a MAF but that could be taken from a 15-17 car if it’s the Whipple air box

[Jcbryantllc]

I'm having similar issues on a gen2 with 2.9whipple. just found out the guy had e85 in it and didn't tell me. do any of you all have a gen2 whipple or cobrajet file for a gen2?

[HextallS550]

What year car?

[Jcbryantllc]

15 to 17 mustang 5.0 manual

[konabluekiller]

Yeah its the maf tube that comes with the whipple kit. Can you use the throttle data from the cobra jet? I wouldn't think so.

[HextallS550]

If you use the M-9600-SCJ16 clean air tube you can use the MAF data from the 16 CJ. If not use the MAF data from a 15-17 Whipple cal.

[konabluekiller]

i used the 15 to 17 maf data but then had to add about 30 percent

[Relentless]

i used the 15 to 17 maf data but then had to add about 30 percent

Yeah when I pulled my Whipple tune it?s MAF transfer was 25%off across the board.