Results 1 to 17 of 17

Thread: Cammed L86 Questions

  1. #1
    Tuner
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Andover, MN
    Posts
    171

    Cammed L86 Questions

    I am having a hell of a refresher right now. Last time I tuned something was still with 2.24 on a Gen 3, lol. Truck has a BTR stage 2 truck cam and ARH 1 7/8 long tubes. Everything else is stock. I am trying to get the MAF tuned first and am having issue with say it 20 percent rich, I take away 10 percent away, and now its 20 percent lean. It reminds me of tuning a VE table that was way out of whack, haha. Idle is about the only thing giving me grief on the MAF tuning. I havent started playing with the O2 sample speeds and delays yet, but didnt know if i need to. Now as far as the VVE tuning goes. I am following Smokeshows write up pretty closely besides I am in full open loop being I never welded a bung for the wideband, so I am using Bank 1 O2 bung. I also had issues with filtering out the DFCO so I disabled that for now too. It seems that when I try to change values in the VVE, the results never come out right the next time I log after flashing. I seen stuff about only tuning per fuel trim cell but after watching Banish's GEN V video for the second time, he doesnt seem to be doing that. Any more write ups or help a ton. I tried already looking through the Gen 4 and 5 howtos and stickys. I tried searching gen v forums through Hptuners and through google. Kind of ending up stuck. I also am chasing a stall, but havnt started to look at that as of writing this. that is around 6:07:09:000.

    Thanks
    Eric
    Attached Files Attached Files
    Last edited by ns158sl; 1 Week Ago at 09:19 PM.

  2. #2
    Senior Tuner SultanHassanMasTuning's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    All Around
    Posts
    2,861
    welcome to genV

    torque based system, is your camshaft locked at 0 degree or still retains VVT
    Follow @MASTUNING
    Remote Tuning Sultan@mastuning.net
    Contact/Whatsapp +966555366161

  3. #3
    Tuner
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Andover, MN
    Posts
    171
    Limiter kit. I think max of 10 degrees each way.

  4. #4
    Tuner
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Andover, MN
    Posts
    171
    So after some deep googling, I think I am finally on the right path. It is tedious, but i am strapped for time being this isnt my truck. If I log as per Smokeshows method, adjust each zone in the VVE, and calculate, it seems the results are actually changing and in the right direction. MAF is just typical maf so that is nice haha. Ill keep you guys updated, as of now I am having worse stall conditions but I am obviously adjusting VVE and the truck is going to stall being it has no idea on how much torque it is making. Obviously if this becomes too much of an issue I will have to start logging torque pids but I have a feeling it is related to torque calcs being airflow model is skewed.

    Eric
    2002 Chev RCSB 2WD Ok sized turbo. 317 heads. 383 5.3

  5. #5
    Tuner
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Andover, MN
    Posts
    171
    Yes, that definitely worked. Truck is not stalling, yet it still needs some work and I might just play with the idle torque settings yet. Seems to get real tough around rolling to a stop from 30... again reminds me of throttle cracker tuning, haha. Still not quite hitting desired idle, that is going to be addressed later. I am already going to pull the wideband and put the O2 back in and refine the VVE. Its not perfect but definitely waaaay better than 6 logs ago haha.
    Attached Files Attached Files
    2002 Chev RCSB 2WD Ok sized turbo. 317 heads. 383 5.3

  6. #6
    Tuner
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Andover, MN
    Posts
    171

    bucking

    Well I think I finally got the VVE pretty dang close. I'll do one more verification tomorrow. I am pretty sure that took care of the random stalling coming to a stop. I have to adjust the idle torque settings to see if that helps bring the idle in gear up closer to desired idle. I see everyone adjusting the external load table but I feel like that is not the correct way, being nothing of that changed on the engine. I was looking for more information on the torque reserve table. I planned on playing with that first. If that is my issue, then great, but holy crap does it buck rolling at around a 1/2 MPH while on the brake.
    Attached Files Attached Files
    2002 Chev RCSB 2WD Ok sized turbo. 317 heads. 383 5.3

  7. #7
    Tuner
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Andover, MN
    Posts
    171
    So I did end up getting the VVE and MAF within 1 to 2 Percent. I am still trying to figure out this idle. I am consistently 50 rpm below desired. I tried all of the stuff listed in the past as far playing with the external load, torque reserve. I tried lowering VT 10 ft lbs around the idle cells and that actually made it worse. I know cmitchell had a ton of posts but it didnt seem he got it dialed in. I also found that video of ghost and he had a huge cam idling around 750. This is a baby cam and it barely idles at desired 750. Any more thoughts? Well after looking through other peoples logs saying they have a good idle.. I guess maybe I am done with mine. I might get a little more aggressive with the VT at idle one more time. Seems the Gen V's idle lowered than desired? Other than that I guess I could do an RPM error and multiply the VT Idle cells by the error and see what happens ha.
    Last edited by ns158sl; 1 Week Ago at 04:28 PM.
    2002 Chev RCSB 2WD Ok sized turbo. 317 heads. 383 5.3

  8. #8
    Tuner
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Andover, MN
    Posts
    171
    Trying a 10 percent and then another 5 percent less Tq in the VT, didn't help at all. It still bucks pretty annoyingly at about a 1/2 mph or less. That will be a pain trying to back up to a trailer. On a side note I was getting diifferent results on the histogram between my desktop and laptop. Turns out the laptop was 4.10.4 and desktop was 4.10.5. I updated them both to 4.10.7 and reviewed the data again now they match. Which means Im going to have to relog for VVE.

    Eric
    Attached Files Attached Files
    2002 Chev RCSB 2WD Ok sized turbo. 317 heads. 383 5.3

  9. #9
    Tuner
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Andover, MN
    Posts
    171
    Ok. So i must of saved a file or overwrite when I didnt want to. So I retouched up the VVE today. It isnt steady state dyno tuned but it is extremely close now. I had it stall only once. Still not making sense to me. I am starting to get real aggressive with the VT. SO i started logging final req toq vs delivered tq into a VT histogram. Im not saying it is right, but i can't quite piece together why it stalls and dies. The truck doesn't even try to stay alive. just dies. The bucking is still there but my old man is going to have to live with that for now, lol. I couldnt upload the log, probably too big. Another thing is I can't mimic the stall which is super weird for me. Anything else I should be logging?

    Thanks
    Eric

    edit. I exported just the log into the smaller file where it is stalling.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Attached Files Attached Files
    Last edited by ns158sl; 6 Days Ago at 11:24 AM.
    2002 Chev RCSB 2WD Ok sized turbo. 317 heads. 383 5.3

  10. #10
    Tuner
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Andover, MN
    Posts
    171
    Ok I slept on it and starting looking for something that jumps out at me again. For one that stalled1.hpl wasnt the right screen shot. I did see the truck with still in 5th gear. Now that to me raises a redflag being I was rolling from an intersection at around 22mph. I feel like there is something there. Problem is why by changing the cam that the trans would have to be adjusted for that, if that is the issue.

    Eric
    Attached Files Attached Files
    2002 Chev RCSB 2WD Ok sized turbo. 317 heads. 383 5.3

  11. #11
    Potential Tuner
    Join Date
    Dec 2021
    Location
    Lexington KY
    Posts
    7
    Im no way an expert on GM gen V tuning. But, I do know that the transmission must be tuned along with engine. The transmission is factory tuned with the factory VVT settings and AFM. Im a transmission tech for GM by day, and GM commands the torque converter to lock after 1st gear and anytime after that when factors are met. The bucking youre experiencing could be the need for a higher stall Converter. The entire system is torque based. engine and trans work together. If I were you, maybe reach out to Ben Charles or another veteran tuner on here to maybe help with a base tune to get the truck driveable, so you dont hurt it. Best of luck!

  12. #12
    Tuner in Training
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    40
    I am also running a BTR stage 2 cam on a 2017 L86 with 1-7/8 long tubes with all else stock. Like you most of my learning curve for the HP Tuner was on Gen3 also an back in 2011. Then some light tuning here and there on blue moons. My last truck was a 2015 2500HD 6.0L though so I got to experience a little of the torque based, but was all stock.

    I actually just got the truck together last night enough to start it for the first time. For my initial tune I compared mine to a file I grabbed from another post that had a l86 8l90 with a blackbear tune.
    https://forum.hptuners.com/showthrea...=blackbear+l86
    Parts of that file looked odd though and some think it was caused by going from efi live to hp tuners.

    Anyway, I grabbed your "MOD VT Idle TQ.hpt" file and am checking out the changes to have done which I am bringing into mine. I can then help by telling you if I have the same issues you are having since your combo is almost identical.

  13. #13
    Senior Tuner Ben Charles's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Calibrating
    Posts
    2,881
    Working with original poster, if I can help anyone please let me know! I put my work against anyone

    Email Tunes, Bencharles_10@hotmail.com
    96 TA Blown/Stroked, 4L80E/Fab 9
    15 C7 A8 H/C 2.3 Blower/PI
    14 Gen 5 Viper
    Custom Mid Engine chassis, AKA GalBen C

  14. #14
    Tuner
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Andover, MN
    Posts
    171
    +1 for Ben C. So that Mod vt is still mine in process, which ill maybe come back to just for a learning stand point maybe. That one i didnt adjust the VT map tables by accident lol. So besides that i had the vve and maf within a few percent WITHOUT steady state dyni, which Greg Banish verified to me recently that absolutely has to be steady state. So mine tables with a grain if salt. As far as of right now i am working with Ben and that is great. The only thing i wish i did when i had the engine on the stand was check EVC because BTR will not release that.

    Eric

  15. #15
    Tuner in Training
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    40
    Thanks for the update and added info. I also wish I checked valve event degrees on mine. I did check piston to valve clearance on the intake which was 0.100", but the day after I bolted on the heads then I got to thinking I really wish I checked for the exhaust valve since then I could modify the limiter to get some extra cruise retard out of it. Adding some set screws to an old VVT assembly and using a degree wheel would have worked out well like done here.
    https://ls1tech.com/forums/generatio...nce-w-vvt.html

  16. #16
    Tuner in Training
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    40
    For my tuning I am going to use the Calculated EVC of 0.5 deg ATDC using the cam card specs of 210/223 111-0 and Wallace racing cam deg calculator.
    http://www.wallaceracing.com/cam-deg-calc.php

  17. #17
    Tuner
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Andover, MN
    Posts
    171
    What did you pick for a centerline? I guess actually a guy can just average betwee. Like a 108 to 111 intake cause id think it has to be within there.