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Thread: Are the 3.6L VVT Spark Tables useful?

  1. #1
    Potential Tuner
    Join Date
    Feb 2021
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    Lightbulb Are the 3.6L VVT Spark Tables useful?

    Hey all,

    I have a 2018 Dodge Charger GT with a slightly modified (ported upper and lower intake manifolds and TB, CAI, Coilpacks, and exhaust) 3.6L Pentastar engine in it.
    I am curious if anyone ever really utilizes the VVT spark tables, I've seen in multiple places people recommending setting them to all the same values and leaving them, is that really the best thing to do, or is it just the easy thing to do?
    My thought here is that you could tune these tables individually, then throw them back into the "main/master" tune file and be able to throw the cams all over the place without really having to worry too much about adjusting the spark every time you make a cam adjustment.
    VVTSPARK.png
    In my head the process looks something like this:
    1. Create a tune file for each VVT spark table
    2. Set both cams to be at lockpin position at all times
    3. Set all spark tables to be equal to the stock lockpin timing
    4. Tune the VE table in the NN
    5. Tune spark
    6. Record the results into a "main/master" file
    7. repeat steps 2-6 for each VVT spark table.
    My theory is that process would result in the ECU being able to adjust the spark accurately for whatever cam timing you throw at it meaning you could then tune each of the rest of the VE tables in the NN without touching timing.
    Am I on the right track here or am I way off base? Is this way more work than necessary and not worth the time and effort that would go into actually accomplishing this? Are there any gaping holes in what I'm saying here where I could end up damaging something if I tried this? I'm relatively new to tuning so if I'm way off base PLEASE TELL ME.

    Thanks in advance for any help/feedback on my ideas! I really appreciate it!

  2. #2
    Tuner in Training
    Join Date
    Jun 2020
    Posts
    34
    NN will adjust each map depending on your weights. If you are going to map it you normally would reduce the amount of NN because you have data for given points. NN creates the data based on weighted coefficients for a given range constants from the engine like VE, RPM, Torque and Airflow.

    VVT timing is used when the cams are transition. I think of it like throttle control when the transmission shifts gears. Ast the cam moves through its position you cN dial back the timing to keep from spiking cylinder pressure vice versa you can add in timing as the intake cam is letting less air in.

  3. #3
    Potential Tuner
    Join Date
    Feb 2021
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    2
    Quote Originally Posted by DAVECS2 View Post
    VVT timing is used when the cams are transition. I think of it like throttle control when the transmission shifts gears. Ast the cam moves through its position you cN dial back the timing to keep from spiking cylinder pressure vice versa you can add in timing as the intake cam is letting less air in.
    So with this in mind, is it valuable/worthwhile to tune these spark tables or are the stock values accurate enough to be left alone?

    If you do tune these tables, due to their use, I'm guessing you'd want to find your knock limit (so long as it's not past MBT) then back it off like four or more degrees, right? OR Do you walk closer to the line on these tables to make more power in the transition areas too?