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Thread: VE table error, what is considered "good"

  1. #1
    Tuner radkon's Avatar
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    VE table error, what is considered "good"

    So I've been playing with my VE table for awhile and figured I'd get some opinions. I created a little spreadsheet in Excel for statistical analysis and can plug in any error rate (or margin of error) and see what percentage of the table is "good". At 4% error (14.09~15.26) the majority (66+%) of my VE table falls in this range. At 3% its about 46%.

    I know when looking at fuel trims people use 0 to -4 as "good"
    So the question is what % error do you use?
    Last edited by radkon; 05-19-2008 at 12:46 PM.
    2004 Yellow M6
    HPT Pro, LM1, SVEDE, 85mm FAST Manifold, 85mm TB, TR224 112 Cam, TEA ported/milled 243 heads, SW LT headers, SW Custom Side Exhaust, King springs, Pedders shocks, Hotchkis sways, Pedders & ES Bushings, DBA rotors, Hawk/Axxis pads, Stoptech lines, shiftlight, AP Sideskirts, AP rear bumper, 05 hood, SAP grilles, Hoens, dual aeroforce gauges
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  2. #2
    Senior Tuner
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    care to post the tool?

  3. #3
    Tuner radkon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by redhardsupra
    care to post the tool?
    I will when its done, right now I'm doing some of the calculations by hand I'm limited by Excel 2000 here at work. I'll play with over the next few days and share it I promise!

    EDIT: I got bored and frustrated at lunch and I think I got it solved! Take a look. Plug in your desired Stoich, desired error rate and paste in your VE table and it will show you how close you are.
    Last edited by radkon; 05-19-2008 at 12:45 PM.
    2004 Yellow M6
    HPT Pro, LM1, SVEDE, 85mm FAST Manifold, 85mm TB, TR224 112 Cam, TEA ported/milled 243 heads, SW LT headers, SW Custom Side Exhaust, King springs, Pedders shocks, Hotchkis sways, Pedders & ES Bushings, DBA rotors, Hawk/Axxis pads, Stoptech lines, shiftlight, AP Sideskirts, AP rear bumper, 05 hood, SAP grilles, Hoens, dual aeroforce gauges
    Stock 309.8 RWHP 330.7 RWTQ
    Now ? RWHP ? RWTQ
    1 of 1014

    2017 Audi A5 2.0T Cabriolet (bone stock) Daily/winter driver

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by radkon
    So the question is what % error do you use?
    I shoot for mostly 1's. I found if I do back to back runs, adjusting my VE after the first run, then doing it again immediately, I get pretty close to all 1's.

  5. #5
    Tuner radkon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gottogo
    I shoot for mostly 1's. I found if I do back to back runs, adjusting my VE after the first run, then doing it again immediately, I get pretty close to all 1's.
    1% error or -1 in LTFT?
    2004 Yellow M6
    HPT Pro, LM1, SVEDE, 85mm FAST Manifold, 85mm TB, TR224 112 Cam, TEA ported/milled 243 heads, SW LT headers, SW Custom Side Exhaust, King springs, Pedders shocks, Hotchkis sways, Pedders & ES Bushings, DBA rotors, Hawk/Axxis pads, Stoptech lines, shiftlight, AP Sideskirts, AP rear bumper, 05 hood, SAP grilles, Hoens, dual aeroforce gauges
    Stock 309.8 RWHP 330.7 RWTQ
    Now ? RWHP ? RWTQ
    1 of 1014

    2017 Audi A5 2.0T Cabriolet (bone stock) Daily/winter driver

  6. #6
    Advanced Tuner
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    Nice work. The only thing that really throws my VE off is when I hand smooth it. My VE error % is always sub 5% though. If you want to be anal, be anal.
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    Formerly - 2004 GTO, 2002 Z28, 2007 Colorado, 2008 Silverado

  7. #7
    Tuner radkon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gh0st
    Nice work. The only thing that really throws my VE off is when I hand smooth it. My VE error % is always sub 5% though. If you want to be anal, be anal.
    The discussion was started here whether it was better to have a "perfect" VE table or a smooth VE table. Greg (Eficalibrator) emphasized the advantages of a smooth table over a "perfect" table. I decided to create this to help find a happy median.
    2004 Yellow M6
    HPT Pro, LM1, SVEDE, 85mm FAST Manifold, 85mm TB, TR224 112 Cam, TEA ported/milled 243 heads, SW LT headers, SW Custom Side Exhaust, King springs, Pedders shocks, Hotchkis sways, Pedders & ES Bushings, DBA rotors, Hawk/Axxis pads, Stoptech lines, shiftlight, AP Sideskirts, AP rear bumper, 05 hood, SAP grilles, Hoens, dual aeroforce gauges
    Stock 309.8 RWHP 330.7 RWTQ
    Now ? RWHP ? RWTQ
    1 of 1014

    2017 Audi A5 2.0T Cabriolet (bone stock) Daily/winter driver

  8. #8
    Tuning Addict WS6FirebirdTA00's Avatar
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    When I get my VE table right, it is smooth anyway. You have to throw out the bad data. When I get close, I do not use histograms to make changes, I look for steady state and pick and choose points to change.
    Sulski Performance Tuning
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  9. #9
    Tuner radkon's Avatar
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    I've added a few buttons to make populating the table easier and changing the Stoich and error rate "dummy proof"
    2004 Yellow M6
    HPT Pro, LM1, SVEDE, 85mm FAST Manifold, 85mm TB, TR224 112 Cam, TEA ported/milled 243 heads, SW LT headers, SW Custom Side Exhaust, King springs, Pedders shocks, Hotchkis sways, Pedders & ES Bushings, DBA rotors, Hawk/Axxis pads, Stoptech lines, shiftlight, AP Sideskirts, AP rear bumper, 05 hood, SAP grilles, Hoens, dual aeroforce gauges
    Stock 309.8 RWHP 330.7 RWTQ
    Now ? RWHP ? RWTQ
    1 of 1014

    2017 Audi A5 2.0T Cabriolet (bone stock) Daily/winter driver