Drivability for TSP Cam

[screamin3800]

I'm relatively new to HPT, I have used DHP for the GM V6's for a few years now. Anyway, a friend of mine asked me to tune his 2000 T/A, M6. It has standard bolt ons (LT's, lid blah blah) and the Texas-Speed XS Series Camshaft:
233/239, .595"/.603" and 113LSA.

This is how I've tuned VE's on the V6's and from what I've read on some of the thread's its the same principle.
Unplug MAF (just disable the SES light, not the code completely for the MAF)
Copy high octane to low octane table
set PE to come in at a higher TP % like 80% etc
Disable LTFT learning in PCM
Flash pcm, clear LTFT's in scanner.
Begin logging, copy paste the STFT average trims multiplied by % on the VE table.
Smooth table, repeat until trims are as close to 0% as possible.

I know about the wideband, I just don't have one yet. He's renting a dyno for the WOT tuning

After about 5 street runs, just cruising around idling - I noticed the car was starting to act better however, at idle the STFT's were still PIG rich, around -39% range on both banks. After the VE table at idle, around 45-60kPa range was like a blackhole, talking 15-17 efficiency ratings for those cells and the trims weren't getting better - I had him plug the MAF back in.

This caused the STFT's to then go really lean, +25% range at idle. I continued the VE tune with the MAF plugged in, left LTFT learning disabled, and I got the STFT's in line and the car is MUCH better now with this method. The VE table also doesn't have that blackhole at the idle rpms and looks better now.

Question is - did I do this the right way? It SEEMS to be working less the issue I have described below. I just don't want to go any further if I have screwed up this foundation process.

The only issue's he has now is the high idle when you push the clutch in, then it drops and almost dies - barely saving itself. I searched and read up about zeroing out the throttle cracker and tuning the RAF table to correct this.

Thoughts?

[SS8UUP]

subscribing

[WS6FirebirdTA00]

Two things:

1) If the MAF had the IAT in it, then you needed to leave it plugged in.

2) If you did not fail the MAF frequency out, then the VE changes you made with the MAF plugged back in were incorrect.

You need a WB to do this right. Narrowband sensors hate headers and can be horrible at switching, I would not trust them to tune with. Tuning idle airflow is one of the most important things to do with a cam.

[screamin3800]

Two things:

1) If the MAF had the IAT in it, then you needed to leave it plugged in.

I will ask him about this.

2) If you did not fail the MAF frequency out, then the VE changes you made with the MAF plugged back in were incorrect.

I just downloaded a SD tuning guide, it's word document. I think I read that before I left the house early this morning - and no I did not fail the frequency out from what I remember in the guide. I will do a search.

You need a WB to do this right. Narrowband sensors hate headers and can be horrible at switching, I would not trust them to tune with.

I know Not even to get the idle/driveability down though? I haven't had issues in the past. I know WOT tuning with narrowbands is a big no no, we haven't even tried that yet. I basically just want to get the car to where it's decent in traffic (which it's not yet because of the stalling issue and high idle when the clutch is first engaged). Sadly, I don't have the pro version of HPT with the ALDL inputs

Tuning idle airflow is one of the most important things to do with a cam.

You're talking about the RAF table? I found a thread that has PID's available for download to tune this table out to get it in line.

[WS6FirebirdTA00]

Yes, the RAF. Narrowbands do best when they are in the factory exhaust manifolds, and not too well in long tubes. If they are new sensors then it would be the best case (but from the looks of your post, I would think they are not giving you the data you would expect).

[screamin3800]

Yes, the RAF. Narrowbands do best when they are in the factory exhaust manifolds, and not too well in long tubes. If they are new sensors then it would be the best case (but from the looks of your post, I would think they are not giving you the data you would expect).

The thing that surprised me the most was the dramatically rich idle without the MAF plugged in and then as soon as it was plugged back in, it went way lean. I've never seen that happen before.

[WS6FirebirdTA00]

I believe it would be rich with it out as the VE in stock form is WAY off for a cam at idle.

[screamin3800]

I believe it would be rich with it out as the VE in stock form is WAY off for a cam at idle.

As I said, the changes I was making weren't making much of a dent in the trims. Sub 20% efficiency at idle?

Should I get the RAF table in line first before I do anything?

[WS6FirebirdTA00]

Post your tune and log, were you changing the secondary VE table?

[screamin3800]

Will do when I get home from work. No, I wasn't changing the secondary VE table.

[WS6FirebirdTA00]

Then that is your problem. That is what is used in SD on 2000 and older OSs.

[screamin3800]

Then that is your problem. That is what is used in SD on 2000 and older OSs.

That explains why the changes I was making to the primary with the MAF unplugged were doing absolutely nothing.

When I plug the MAF back in, it references the primary, correct? If so, should I tune the Primary VE table with the MAF plugged in?

[WS6FirebirdTA00]

No, if the MAF is plugged in, any changes to the VE will be guesses.

Tune the secondary VE, copy the numbers to the primary VE and smooth between the missing rows, and then go back and do the MAF.

[screamin3800]

Understood. Thanks for all of your help.

[screamin3800]

I don't think I did the RAF procedure correctly, it actually made the car surge worse.

As a side note - I noticed the car was burning oil pretty bad at a car show on Wednesday that we went to. Will this cause the narrowbands to be even more fubar? Or does it have no affect on how they read? I can't imagine it helps but wondering if it hurts?

If it does, I don't want to waste anymore time on this until he gets his mechanical issues fixed.

[Country Boy]

[screamin3800]

I got it working, read up more on the RAF tables.