Gen II 2008+ Cadillac CTS 3.6L DI Engine Support?

[csementuh]

Hello. I am thinking of getting a 2008 CTS AWD with the 3.6L direct injection V6. I didn't see it, but I wasn't sure if this PCM is supported? If it isn't is there a plan to support it at a later date? I see the older CTS's are supported, so I would sure hope the newer ones were too.

If it is supported, what all options and gains could be had (in a nutshell)?

I'd love to get rid of my 07' Cobalt SS/SC and get something more roomy and AWD, so I hope I can make this happen.

Thanks!

[Bill@HPTuners]

Currently not a supported pcm, its on our to do list but is still a ways away.

[csementuh]

Thanks for the info! Since this engine is the V6 in the newer Camaro's I can only hope it will be supported sometime in the future.

[Bill@HPTuners]

same engine different pcm's, 2008 Caddy v6 uses 2 different pcm's, one E77 one E69, 2010 Camaro's use an e69 but with a different PN then the 08 Caddy...thats not including the 2009+ caddy v6's who knows how many different PN's they used.

[csementuh]

I understand the frustration, I'm a Software Engineer lol. I can only imagine how much worse it is with reverse engineering embedded systems like that. I do really enjoy your product for my LSJ Cobalt though, so I can only hope you might develop something in the future. Thanks!

[LiteItUpSS]

Will you guys drop your plans to offer a tuning solution if gm upgrades the 2012 v6 motor like it is currently being rumored?

[Bill@HPTuners]

Will you guys drop your plans to offer a tuning solution if gm upgrades the 2012 v6 motor like it is currently being rumored?

Too many factors play into this scenerio to give you a yes or no answer.

[csementuh]

I sure hope HPT chooses to offer tuning for the current 3.6L DI engine (and doesn't drop it), especially since it is now gaining some popularity and aftermarket support!

[Bill@HPTuners]

The problem is GM keeps changing the read strategy so what worked with one pcm doesn't work with the next generation so its like cracking a new pcm for each, if there are a 1/2 dozen of them(which is feasible) its just too much time spent, thats not to mention mapping out these bosch pcm's isn't the easiest thing. If we had unlimited resources & time it wouldn't be an issue but as it sits it doesn't look good.

[csementuh]

I understand the difficulties that would be faced in this type of work. It is certainly no trivial task.

I would only hope that HPT could eventually support the 2008-2010 3.6DI as those should be same group of controllers out now and have been out for a good while now.

I have been holding out on a competitors tuning setup in hopes that I could utilize my existing HPT hardware and software. Maybe my hopes will be realized lol, maybe not.

Thanks for the info Bill!

[Bill@HPTuners]

Unfortunately thats not exactly how it is.

Here are 3 pics, 2 from 2008 Cadillac CTS 3.6 DI
1 from a 2010 Camaro 3.6 DI

What you'll notice is they are all different pcm's.

What this means for us is 3x the work trying to decode the seed key
3x the work for establishing the read/write loaders
3x the work mapping the calibrations

And thats just 2 years of 2 vehicles.

09 CTS v6 pcm is likely different
2011 Camaro v6 pcm is likely different

Thats not to mention the holdens, G8 v6's, etc.

[csementuh]

Bill, I'm very impressed with your technical knowledge on all this! From an IT standpoint I can certainly understand how difficult it may be. Is there any possibility of releasing some support in a beta version for one/some of the supported PCM's, sorta like was done with the 2008+ 2.2L Cobalt's? Is there an easy way to tell which controller is more common or anything, and perhaps develop some support for that platform which holds the most market share? A larger performance aftermarket is developing for these 2nd gen CTS's and it would be great to have HPT support for them!

If it every happens I'll be super happy, but if it doesn't I won't be disappointed.

[LiteItUpSS]

Actuallim pretty sure the 2011 camaro are using the e69 Bosch just like the 10's. Id say the e69 is more common than the others. I honestly hope were not short changed on tuning.

[Bill@HPTuners]

Bill, I'm very impressed with your technical knowledge on all this! From an IT standpoint I can certainly understand how difficult it may be. Is there any possibility of releasing some support in a beta version for one/some of the supported PCM's, sorta like was done with the 2008+ 2.2L Cobalt's? Is there an easy way to tell which controller is more common or anything, and perhaps develop some support for that platform which holds the most market share? A larger performance aftermarket is developing for these 2nd gen CTS's and it would be great to have HPT support for them!

If it every happens I'll be super happy, but if it doesn't I won't be disappointed.

Unlikely, our head engineer is the only one that knows how these pcm's work and he's knee deep in dodge right now. I really don't see him having much of any time to look into these any further until late this year at best and by then its likely alot of the interest will die down so we'll then need to reevaluate the market.

[csementuh]

Thanks for the update Bill.

I need to do some more research myself to see what PCM is in my Caddy. It seems that the E69 is the more common one and is shared by some Camaro's so that might help the tuning aftermarket later on.

Bill, I saw you had posted on a Camaro forum about the possibility of a 3.6DI solution but it would only have very limited access (something like 30 tables?) in the PCM. I still think that if possible that might be a good option for even a beta version of HPT. I understand your product is a 'full feature' tuning suite, however some basic to moderate support for something beats nothing at all. It would be nice to adjust AFR, timing, speed limiter, speedo settings, trans shifts, etc if nothing else.

Ohhh well HPT is still a great product even if I can't use it! Thanks for all the great info!

[Bill@HPTuners]

Thanks for the update Bill.

I need to do some more research myself to see what PCM is in my Caddy. It seems that the E69 is the more common one and is shared by some Camaro's so that might help the tuning aftermarket later on.

Bill, I saw you had posted on a Camaro forum about the possibility of a 3.6DI solution but it would only have very limited access (something like 30 tables?) in the PCM. I still think that if possible that might be a good option for even a beta version of HPT. I understand your product is a 'full feature' tuning suite, however some basic to moderate support for something beats nothing at all. It would be nice to adjust AFR, timing, speed limiter, speedo settings, trans shifts, etc if nothing else.

Ohhh well HPT is still a great product even if I can't use it! Thanks for all the great info!

lol, don't misquote me please. What I said was

"Companies like trifecta that might only need access to 30 tables can map them out pretty quickly and then add a table or two as needed if needed.

If we released a "full tuning suite" with 30 tables we'd be chastised so theres a much larger investment in time that we would need to dedicate then someone offering a handheld or mail order tune solution."

We will NOT be releasing a full tuning suite with 30 tables.

Additionally mapping out tables isn't the issue, reading the pcm is. Without being able to read the pcm(s) its not even possible for us to map them.

[csementuh]

Sorry Bill, I was just trying to paraphrase what I got out of what you said.

Thanks for the information.

[LiteItUpSS]

Based on current interest and the amount of people that have hopes the tuning issue will be resolved one day I don't think well see a hit in interest. This seems similar to the controversy that came with the 2.4 cobalt waiting for tuning support. All in all, it is unlikely that a tuning solution will be released, and then on top of that a full tubing solution would be unlikely even if you all did create a solution, just so I have the correct story?

[Bill@HPTuners]

Based on current interest and the amount of people that have hopes the tuning issue will be resolved one day I don't think well see a hit in interest. This seems similar to the controversy that came with the 2.4 cobalt waiting for tuning support. All in all, it is unlikely that a tuning solution will be released, and then on top of that a full tubing solution would be unlikely even if you all did create a solution, just so I have the correct story?

We released support for the 2.4 cobalt and IMO we would've been better off going in a different direction as the amount of people that have contacted us for this support has been less then stellar from where I sit. There were "so many" people that wanted this then when we finally released it(at least for the late model 07+ cobalts) barely anybody actually wanted to tune them. So while there is always someone shouting for support it doesn't always pan out how you'd like and spending hundreds or even thousands of man hours doing the work it really needs to be worth our while so picking and choosing our battles correctly is a necessity.

-Bill