Part Throttle Timing Discussion - Lost Art?

[06300CSRT8]

One thing that baffles me a bit is the lack of any real time spent on tweaking part throttle (including idle) timing advance. It would seem these adjustments could have a very positive (and negative) effect to how the vehicle behaves when it is heavily modified with a larger displacement, bigger cam, bigger throttle body, etc etc. Yet I have never seen a tune by any tuner (very BROAD Statement, I know, just my experience) ever tweak the off idle, part throttle cruising timing areas. Why so? I know in most v8 applications, the PT Advance table has this huge timing peak right around converter lockup speeds, which is usually dialed back by tuners since the stock converter is often ditched for a higher stall.

Just looking to have an open discussion and see what most people think. I would think more timing in part throttle could help with a sluggish big cam, low compression setup outside of boost.

[GeForce1986]

well my car have heavy mods and i face this issue to ..
waiting for someone to lead the way

[JoshCP527]

Part throttle tuning is the most time consuming without real time adjustment and feed back.

[Ready4Ready4astrike]

well my car have heavy mods and i face this issue to ..
waiting for someone to lead the way

hello guys ... i posted something regarding pt timing once and got no response ....from any one .... figured that no one likes to give away their secrets lol... this is how i done it with excellent results ..

say on wherever fuel you are using there is only so much potential energy that can be used at wherever time (energy can not be created nether destroyed) .

assuming you have done all the basic fuel, air adjustments and the car runs and drives ok. paying close attention to the cells on the spark table were you are under load only ... make a graph to log just like your pt spark table but log long LTFT instead of spark (nn off and a wideband is best if you are into that) .. log/drive as if you were tuning your ve table. no throttle snaps basically .

for the adjustments ... picture this the fuel you are using only have so much energy stored in it ... by giving the motor "what it wants" basically just re scale your injectors and you are done (lol bull) ...to optimize add or take away 2 to 3 degree's in your pt load cells that it hits and compare to your previous log. you will notice the fuel ether start to go rich or lead on dose particular cells .....

if rich = you are going the wrong way ..... if you added timing for your next log take away timing (no fuel correction)
if lean = you are making your motor more efficient (more energy used for the fuel being injected) correct fuel but do not add timing till fuel is corrected
repeat till it stars going rich back it up 2 to 3 degrees from peak (incase you get bad fuel) (from all the years as a technician i have seen bad fuel twice the rest of the time the consumer is just pumping in regular fuel and paying for premium bunch of crooked stations out there)
don't do this for wot since you will never reach full efficiency due to knock

it takes time and patience
my personal truck 5.7 bore, stroked, cam, etc etc etc and a pin wheel just for fun lol
stock average mpg's stock 13.5 to 14.5
after all mods and pin wheel 18.5
not jerking or weird surges of rpm's wile on pt

for all the other cells no load/de-cel that's were you can give the motor its particular characteristics for wherever you are using it for. if you want the motor to stay up on the rpm's coming of a corner drop the timing under low load/ high vacuum, or if you want it to come strait to idle after you let off the skinny add a little more timing on the corresponding cells ...

i am not a tuner just have noting better to do.