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Thread: 03 V6 Astro AWD log towing 5000lb trailer

  1. #1
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    03 V6 Astro AWD log towing 5000lb trailer

    I was hoping I could ask for some input from my "mentor" Paul and from anyone else who would have some time.

    The attached log, long.. sorry, is the Astro pulling my camping trailer home on a nice warm afternoon. The van is in Tow/Haul mode and the shifter is in 3 not D for the whole drive.

    Let me preface with a couple of things.

    1. I know I need to do something about the lousy factory intake and am going to add the 170F t-stat in place of the 190. The IAT's get way out of control.

    2. I've already changed the A/C parameters to something more realistic. 3500/3000 rpm and 75/55 tps. I had it set much lower, was a warm ride home.

    3. While driving I hit some markers where I had real bad periods of bog. These are the ones without comments. The wind comment was just me heading into a nasty head wind. The no AC is where I got real hot.

    4. Even what you see here is a HUGE improvement over stock.. The HPTuners product just rocks...

    5. This is a slightly modifiied tune from the one that Paul helped me with.

    6. Shifts were nice and quick but not hard. Nice and firm..

    The periods of major bog have me confused. As you can see they are all during upshifts. But what catches my eye is how much the timing retards with the shift. Some points the advance went negative. You can really feel it and at times I have to put my foot into the throttle to get moving again.

    Also the amount KR surprised me. And my spark tables look like a mess compared to what I see with you guys. Side note, I have not removed the KR in the log from the attached tune file.

    If you guys could make some suggestions on how to approach this I would really appreciate it. I am thinking of kicking up the 1-2 and 2-3 shifts another 500+ rpm's to start. If not more. Not sure how to handle the spark table.

    I get about 9 mpg around town towing this thing so I don't get too much time to log and test... Plus at 2.80 a gal down here it sure gets expensive.

    Thanks in advance.
    Hank
    Last edited by FGCUhank; 03-30-2007 at 11:59 PM.

  2. #2
    Супер Модератор EC_Tune's Avatar
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    I only WISH it was 2.80/gal.

    http://losangelesgasprices.com/
    3.21 for the cheap crap in my local burg.
    Always Support Our Troops!

  3. #3
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    I feel for you. Used to live in the "OC" Mission Viejo and Rancho Santa Margarita..

  4. #4
    Advanced Tuner gman4dx266's Avatar
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    just hit 2.48 here and people are already bitchin bout thier hoes, burbs, silvys and hummers. heh.

    I saw a tad KR in there. You had 4* there at one point

    And i see that you have that retarded MAP like I had on my 4.3. That sensor would trip everything else out and if/when id cruise over about 80, all my trims were disabled.

    Id say also, log some transmission params. See how much converter slip you have going on in there.

    Also where are these comments in the log you're speaking of?

    EDIT: for your TCC settings, you can -try- setting the TCC Duty Cycle max table to 100 and the min to 90. It works on some and not on others, if you get/hear converter chatter back off of it some.

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    I see you hit the 4* but there is a couple of things. Intake air temp is one. It's kinda up but not that bad, but could cause some of it. Cooler t-stat is going to help too. I'd get the thermostat in it and fix up that intake. Get another run logged after with the repairs done. You could raise your TCC tables a bit for now like gman says, and log all the trans stuff you can as well.
    Post a scan with your TCC table raised a bit while scanning those trans parameters. We do need to try to see if the trans is slipping or not.



  6. #6
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    Thanks for the reply guys. Question on the slipping as you just scared the hell out of me.. Are you talking slip as in trans damage or ??? Does the computer(s) try to react to trans slipping? Or are my shift points just too low with my lousy gears and causing bog? It feels like the TC stays locked during the shift. No major rev up. The RPM's come down with the shift.

    I'll have to take some pics on how bad this factory intake setup is.. Who puts an intake on top of a radiator and 10" above the grill.. WTF..

    It will be a few days before I post back with a log as we are prepping the trailer for the summer camping/hurricane evacuation season. Also am adding the satellite TV and lcd monitors You know, the important stuff.

    Thanks
    hg

  7. #7
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    Whoops forgot one thing. I made a couple of comments and markers. Do they get uploaded in the logs? I tried to mark, within a second or two every hard bog upshift as I was driving.

  8. #8
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    In San Diego I just paid $3.29/gal. for the cheap stuff on my rental. $47.00 to fill it up from 1/8 of a tank.
    Mitchell

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  9. #9
    Advanced Tuner gman4dx266's Avatar
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    Hank,
    I didnt see any comments in the scan log, so i dont know...maybe its just a user error on my end. I didnt even know we could put in comments! lol

    By slipping i mean torque converter slip/unnecessary stall. Like driving a manual trans, but never fully letting the clutch out=lost power=bad mileage=variable performance hit.

    saying the tcc FEELS like it stays locked, really proves nothing...it can slip quite a bit and you wouldnt know it. log some tcc params (after you take out a bank loan for some gas) and see what kinda shape you're in. You gotta get that thing running good for hurricane evacuation. When the time comes, you can just jump on I75(i think) and go northbound with the hammer down!

  10. #10
    Супер Модератор EC_Tune's Avatar
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    There should be a TCC Slip RPM parameter that you can log in the trans section of PID's. That will definitely tell you.
    Always Support Our Troops!

  11. #11
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    You guys need to see a pic of Hanks trailer set up. Man, it's the shiznizzle!!


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    Thanks guys.. Here is the link to what Paul is talking about.

    http://www.flexplorers.com/photopost...user=1&thumb=1

    I think this pic would be great for the HPTuner's featured vehicle http://www.flexplorers.com/photopost...hingIt-med.jpg

    I found the TC pids and got them set to log in the scanner. It will be a few days, perhaps a week till I get to drag it behind me again.

    I watched the drive home log a few times last night, nothing on TV and Netflix did not arrive on Saturday. Think I found some of my bog issue. I was driving around like an old man. Most of the time the TPS never exceeded 40% and even "getting up to speed" for one section of 55mph road I never got over 60% TPS. Also with the gears I have, 3.42's my shift RPM's were close to that of what a honda idles at.. Bottom line that tune from my mentor really helped big time as I had much more power than before but I probably need to give the little V6 some juice when it is pulling a 5000lb van and a 5000lb trailer.

    In the interim, I took the shift tables and TC apply/release table and bumped up all the numbers by 3mph. Looks like at 40% tps I am going into THIRD! at 24mph That kicks the RPMS down to something like 1700-1900 which is high idle for a Honda right?

    Thanks again guys for all the input! I'll get the logs posted as soon as I can.

    All the best.

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    The exterior tv was what I liked. Wicked idea.

  14. #14
    Advanced Tuner gman4dx266's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FGCUhank
    Most of the time the TPS never exceeded 40% and even "getting up to speed" for one section of 55mph road I never got over 60% TPS. Also with the gears I have, 3.42's my shift RPM's were close to that of what a honda idles at.. Bottom line that tune from my mentor really helped big time as I had much more power than before but I probably need to give the little V6 some juice when it is pulling a 5000lb van and a 5000lb trailer.
    Yeah, gotta juice it a lil more lol.

    Quote Originally Posted by FGCUhank
    In the interim, I took the shift tables and TC apply/release table and bumped up all the numbers by 3mph. Looks like at 40% tps I am going into THIRD! at 24mph That kicks the RPMS down to something like 1700-1900 which is high idle for a Honda right?
    Heh, For comparison reasons only, my 06 4.3 V6 w/ 3.23's would spin about 1800 @ 70mph w/ its .7:1 4th gear. Idk anything about hondas. Foreign stuff grosses me out. hahah

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    Drove it back to storage today. Huge improvement in performance with the shift and lockup "upped" 3mph. Will need to do some slight tweeking. Perhaps 2mph on the low and high ends and 3 in the middle but it was really drivable and shifted/towed almost how I'd like to see it.

    In the log there is one WOT test. LOL I think it is a 45 second quarter mile. Not that impressive compared to you guys but remember I have an extra 5000 lbs behind me. For fun I filled up the water tank for some extra weight.

    Have not had a chance to go through the log in detail yet but I'll post it anyway. I logged the trans params as asked. I'd appreciate any input you guys would have.

    Still need to get the 170F t-stat in and unfortunatly my LCD TV is on backorder. Will give me a chance to do some more test runs before camping and evacuations.

  16. #16
    Advanced Tuner gman4dx266's Avatar
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    converter looks pretty good to me, no horrendous slip going on really. I did see about .7 or so *'s of KR during your one WOT run (frame 4526).

    Also, I see your PE AFR is @ 13.0. Im not sure if thats good or bad, but i notice theres little spark advance when you're in PE. Not sure if you can add more spark advance to your PE only though.

  17. #17
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    170 t-stat just came in. Will be back on this in a couple of days.

  18. #18
    Advanced Tuner n0dih's Avatar
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    I have the factory Cadillac V4P tow package car, I can send you what in 1994 was a great towing setup on the transmission, as it was setup for full time towing if you are interested.

    I use TunerCat as HPT doesn't do OBD1. So somethings will have to be inferred of what Cadillac had to what GM does now.

    My car is a 94 with 219K and stock trans that shifts wonderfully still.

  19. #19
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    Hey, I would really appreciate it.. Thanks!

  20. #20
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    Just a quick post back. I need to get some logs up but with the cool T-stat in and playing with some shift points and settings the improvement has been incredible. My trans and coolant temps are way down even when towing.

    Still need to sort out the air intake/IAT issue. It is still sucking engine compartment air and at low speeds the IAT's go way up. Been searching a number of van and astro sites with no luck. All the guys just run an open filter setup and have the same IAT issues as me.


    BTW, put on some BFG A/T KO tires, same size as stock to avoid a gear change. Next step is the 2" lift that has been sitting in the garage for over a year.
    Last edited by FGCUhank; 05-22-2007 at 01:40 PM.