o2 adjustment and fpr questions

[2HiPsi]

For the life of my car it has always seemed like it can't keep the fuel coming with the higher rpms...

For those who don't know, I partially demodded my car during the fall to work on a new setup. Today, I got bored and decided to go scan and play with HP Tuners. I previously used an LS1M/ICCU combo to adjust timing and fuel.

Mods: XP Cam, !u-bend, SLP LM, IS2 PCM, 160*, 103s @ .045", 3.8" pulley

Here's a look at the WOT portion of the scan:

rpm, mph, tps, ign, kr, maf, ect, iat, o2, ipw, ltft

3676 27 100 20.5 0 21.03 160 46 924 16.9 1.6
3803 29 100 20.5 0 22.53 160 46 920 17.6 1.6
3928 29 100 21 0 23.17 160 46 924 17.5 1.6
3940 29 100 21 0 23.38 160 46 920 17.7 1.6
4012 30 100 21 0 23.53 160 46 924 17.5 1.6
4087 32 100 20.5 0 23.95 158 46 924 17.5 1.6
4125 33 100 20.5 0 24.57 160 46 920 17.8 1.6
4204 34 100 20.5 0 25.49 158 46 911 18.1 1.6
4287 35 100 20.5 0 25.49 158 46 907 17.8 1.6
4431 36 100 20 0 26.48 158 46 907 17.9 1.6
4507 37 100 20 0 26.98 158 46 911 18 1.6
4617 38 100 19.5 0 27.92 160 46 898 18.2 1.6
4717 39 100 19.5 0 28.21 158 46 903 18 1.6
4838 40 100 19.5 0 28.8 158 46 894 18 1.6
4929 41 100 19.5 0 29.39 158 46 898 18.1 1.6
5004 42 100 19.5 0 30.39 158 46 890 18.4 1.6
5121 43 100 19.5 0 30.32 158 46 877 18 1.6
5222 44 100 19.5 0.3 31.51 158 46 894 18.4 1.6
5306 45 100 18 1.6 31.32 158 46 851 18 1.6
5416 46 100 18 1.8 32.04 158 46 877 18.1 1.6
5506 47 100 18 1.5 33.48 158 46 864 18.6 1.6
5600 48 100 17.5 3.4 33.48 158 46 877 18.3 1.6
5672 48 100 16.5 3.2 34.17 158 46 859 18.5 1.6
5772 50 100 16 3.8 34.9 158 46 864 18.6 1.6
5875 50 100 16 3.5 34.78 158 46 855 18.2 1.6
5982 51 100 15 4.7 35.87 158 46 846 18.5 1.6
5982 52 100 15.5 4.4 35.74 158 46 842 18.5 1.6
6121 53 100 15.5 4.1 36.25 158 48 755 18.3 1.6
6178 53 100 16 3.8 36.25 158 48 790 18.2 1.6
6237 55 100 16 3.5 36.36 158 48 846 18.1 1.6
6327 55 100 16.5 3.2 36.86 158 48 838 18.1 1.6
6327 55 100 17 2.9 37.18 158 46 773 18.3 1.6
6388 55 100 17 2.5 37.27 158 48 820 18.2 1.6
6296 57 100 16.5 2.3 36.75 158 48 829 18.1 1.6
5982 57 100 6 2.9 35.53 158 48 859 18.3 1.6
5222 59 100 4 2.6 32.23 158 46 903 18.8 1.6
4372 58 100 17.5 2.3 27.52 158 48 929 18.8 1.6
4151 60 100 18.5 2 25.29 158 48 924 18.2 1.6
4125 60 100 18.5 1.8 24.63 158 48 920 17.8 1.6
4164 61 100 19 1.4 25.03 158 48 916 17.9 1.6
4178 62 100 19 1.1 24.6 158 48 911 17.6 1.6
4191 62 100 19.5 0.8 24.84 158 48 911 17.7 1.6
4218 63 100 19.5 0.5 25.49 158 48 911 18.1 1.6
4231 63 100 20 0.3 25.49 158 48 903 18 1.6
4245 63 100 20.5 0 25.29 158 48 907 17.8 1.6
4273 64 100 20 0 25.98 158 48 907 18.2 1.6
4301 65 100 20 0 25.49 158 48 898 17.7 1.6
4301 65 100 19.5 0.7 25.74 158 48 907 17.9 1.6
4343 66 100 19.5 0.4 25.98 158 48 898 17.9 1.6
4387 66 100 20 0.1 25.98 158 48 898 17.8 1.6
4401 67 100 20 0 26.23 158 48 898 17.9 1.6
4431 67 100 20 0 26.5 158 48 898 17.9 1.6
4461 68 100 20 0 26.76 158 48 890 18 1.6
4491 68 100 20 0 27.01 158 48 894 18.1 1.6
4538 69 100 20 0 27.31 158 48 894 18.1 1.6
4538 69 100 19.5 0 26.76 158 48 894 17.7 1.6
4569 70 100 19 0.7 27.83 158 48 885 18.3 1.6
4601 71 100 19 0.4 27.92 158 48 885 18.3 1.6
4617 71 100 19.5 0.2 28.06 158 48 877 18.3 1.6
4650 71 100 19.5 0 27.87 156 48 890 18.1 1.6
4700 72 100 18 1.2 27.64 158 48 881 17.7 1.6
4700 72 100 18.5 1 28.21 158 48 868 18.1 1.6
4734 73 100 18 1.5 28.51 158 48 885 18.2 1.6
4751 74 100 18 1.2 28.57 158 48 868 18.1 1.6
4785 74 100 18 1.2 28.87 158 48 859 18.2 1.6
4838 75 100 18.5 1 28.87 158 48 872 18 1.6
4874 75 100 16.5 2.5 29.99 158 48 864 18.6 1.6
4892 76 100 17 2.2 29.39 156 46 864 18.2 1.6
4929 76 100 17.5 1.9 30.1 158 48 872 18.5 1.6
4929 76 100 17.5 1.7 29.69 156 48 859 18.2 1.6
4947 78 100 18 1.3 30.1 158 48 859 18.4 1.6
4985 78 100 18 1.1 30.2 158 48 864 18.4 1.6
5023 78 100 16.5 3 30.7 158 48 868 18.5 1.6
5042 79 100 16.5 2.7 30.7 158 46 838 18.5 1.6
5101 80 100 16.5 2.9 30.51 158 46 859 18.1 1.6
5081 80 100 16.5 2.6 30.7 158 48 859 18.4 1.6
5121 80 100 17 2.4 30.39 158 48 846 18 1.6
5161 81 100 16 3.3 31.35 158 48 855 18.5 1.6
5202 81 100 15.5 4.2 31.16 156 48 855 18.2 1.6
5202 82 100 15.5 3.9 30.96 158 46 851 18.1 1.6
5243 82 100 16 3.6 31.7 158 46 842 18.4 1.6
5264 83 100 16 3.3 31.32 156 46 842 18.1 1.6
5285 83 100 15 4.2 31.68 158 46 846 18.3 1.6
5285 84 100 14 5.5 31.48 158 46 851 18.2 1.6
5306 85 100 14 5.3 32.04 158 46 851 18.4 1.6
5328 85 100 14.5 5 32.23 158 46 825 18.5 1.6
5371 85 100 15 4.7 32.44 156 46 842 18.5 1.6
5393 86 100 15 4.4 32.84 158 46 820 18.6 1.6
5416 86 100 15.5 4 33.01 158 46 851 18.7 1.6
5461 86 100 15.5 3.8 33.41 158 46 829 18.8 1.6
5483 87 100 16 3.5 33.24 158 46 846 18.6 1.6
5483 87 100 14 5.5 33.48 158 46 829 18.7 1.6
5506 88 100 14 5.3 32.88 156 46 838 18.3 1.6
5553 88 100 14.5 4.9 33.48 158 46 829 18.5 1.6
5576 88 100 14.5 4.7 33.48 158 46 833 18.5 1.6
5576 89 100 14.5 4.9 34.48 158 46 833 19 1.6
5600 89 100 12.5 6.6 33.48 158 46 820 18.4 1.6
5624 89 100 13 6.2 33.9 158 46 812 18.6 1.6
5648 90 100 13 6 33.74 158 46 838 18.4 1.6
5697 91 100 13.5 5.6 34.17 158 46 820 18.5 1.6
5697 91 100 13.5 5.4 34.33 158 46 820 18.6 1.6
5747 91 100 14 5.1 34.33 158 46 803 18.5 1.6
5722 92 100 12.5 6.8 34.76 158 46 781 18.8 1.6
5772 92 100 12.5 6.4 34.62 158 46 799 18.6 1.6
5772 92 100 13 6.2 34.46 158 46 812 18.5 1.6
5772 93 100 13 6.2 35.04 158 46 816 18.8 1.6
5797 93 100 13 5.9 34.33 158 46 820 18.4 1.6
5823 94 100 13.5 5.5 34.93 158 46 807 18.6 1.6
5849 94 100 13.5 5.3 35.65 158 46 816 18.9 1.6
5875 94 100 14 4.9 35.07 158 46 807 18.6 1.6
5928 95 100 14.5 4.7 35.87 158 46 816 18.8 1.6
5982 95 100 14.5 4.3 35.65 158 46 807 18.6 1.6
5982 96 100 15 4 35.4 158 46 807 18.4 1.6
5982 96 100 14 4.9 35.87 158 46 807 18.7 1.6
5982 96 100 14 4.6 36.86 158 46 799 19.2 1.6
5982 97 100 14 4.7 35.4 158 46 807 18.5 1.6
6064 98 100 14.5 4.4 36 158 46 777 18.6 1.6
6064 98 100 14.5 4 36.36 158 46 812 18.8 1.6
6093 98 100 15 3.8 36.47 158 46 790 18.8 1.6
6093 98 100 13.5 5.2 36.36 158 46 799 18.7 1.6
6093 98 100 13.5 4.9 36 158 46 786 18.6 1.6
6121 99 100 14 4.7 36.86 158 46 803 18.9 1.6
6178 99 100 14 4.4 36.25 158 46 803 18.4 1.6
6178 100 100 12.5 6.3 36.86 158 46 768 18.8 1.6
6178 100 100 12.5 6 36.25 158 46 794 18.5 1.6
6207 100 100 13 5.7 36.64 158 46 803 18.6 1.6
6237 101 100 13 5.4 37.27 158 46 816 18.8 1.6
6207 101 100 12 6.7 36.86 158 46 794 18.8 1.6
6267 101 100 12 6.3 36.64 158 46 773 18.5 1.6
6296 102 100 12.5 6.1 36.75 158 46 781 18.5 1.6
6327 102 100 12.5 5.7 36.64 158 46 790 18.3 1.6
6327 102 100 13 5.5 36.75 158 46 773 18.4 1.6
6357 103 100 13.5 5.1 36.75 158 46 816 18.3 1.6
6327 103 100 13.5 5 36.12 158 46 764 18.1 1.6




What can I change to add more fuel with HP Tuners?? I'd like to become a lot more familiar with the program before I add the Intercooler and Stage 3 Blower I have laying around...

[arthansen]

I am assuming this is a GTP. Do you have a WBO2? If not, you should get one. It will really make tuning safer and easier.

I am not sure what you mean by not enough fuel. Your AFR seems good (Not too lean). If you are talking about power, you need to work on your PE table. You will want to adjust the Power Enrichment table Add vs RPM vs Time. I would not adjust the PE setings without a WBO2. With the SC I would shoot for a 12.5 AFR. Log your WBO2 and where you are rich, decrease the corisponding value in the table.

For example:

If you are getting 12.0 AFT @ 3200 rpms, subtract .5 (add -.5) to the 3200 column in the Power Enrichment table Add vs RPM vs Time. If you see 13.0, add .5. Do this in each column and then log again. Keep doing this untill you are near 12.5 in all cells during WOT. Hope this helps.

[2HiPsi]

Not sure where you're coming from saying that the air/fuel ration looks good. The narrowband o2 values were getting in the low 800s in the upper rpm's of each gear on a non-intercooled car.

I highly doubt my injectors are static because I am on a 3.8" pulley, although, I am going to 6400 RPMs.

If the fpr is bad, swapping entire fuel rails would take of my problem, correct? I have another set of them laying around that I will extend and use when I install the intercooler I have in my goody bag.

[arthansen]

I was looking at your first peak RPMs, You do look lean over 6000. However, you are not at your duty cycle. Close, (96%) but not there yet. You need to add fuel in the PE table. I have the calculation backwards in the above post. You want to take away to add fuel (seems odd but what you are doing is lowering the AFR).

You might want to upgrade your injectors beeing so close to the duty cycle. The intercooler will inable you to advance your timing some more or at least get rid of the KR. That KR is killing you. I have the same CAM and I had a lot of false knock. I desensitized the sensor and my knock problem is gone. Try adding fuel in those upper RPM area. Good luck.

[WCP]

the VE table is your friend

[Quick6]

I am assuming this is a GTP. Do you have a WBO2? If not, you should get one. It will really make tuning safer and easier.

I am not sure what you mean by not enough fuel. Your AFR seems good (Not too lean). If you are talking about power, you need to work on your PE table. You will want to adjust the Power Enrichment table Add vs RPM vs Time. I would not adjust the PE setings without a WBO2. With the SC I would shoot for a 12.5 AFR. Log your WBO2 and where you are rich, decrease the corisponding value in the table.

For example:

If you are getting 12.0 AFT @ 3200 rpms, subtract .5 (add -.5) to the 3200 column in the Power Enrichment table Add vs RPM vs Time. If you see 13.0, add .5. Do this in each column and then log again. Keep doing this untill you are near 12.5 in all cells during WOT. Hope this helps.

With the SC I would shoot for a 12.5 AFR Yea like if you want to melt a piston!!!!!!

Factory wants 10.4:1 to 10.9:1 I had mine all the way
down to 9.7.1 ??? What was i thinking ;D

Seriously, with our s/c cars shoot for 11.1 to 11.4 or 940 w/o an i/c to be safe. Bump your maff table 10% and see what happens.

VE does knothing on our cars as long as the maff is properly functioning.
Rob

[WCP]

VE does knothing on our cars as long as the maff is properly functioning.
Rob

that simply is not true

[Quick6]

that simply is not true

From the help file,
"Primary VE Percent vs. RPM vs. MAP: This table is used to determine airmass per cylinder in case of MAF failure and also to provide a base airflow value to check for MAF failure. It is also used to provide transient condition correction to the VCM main airmass calculations. Although it is not strictly a VE table in the traditional sense, it is displayed in % for convenience. "

Trust me, many many hours of tuning and playing and scanning, on the V6 SUPERCHARGED cars, which i'm referring to, the VE table is best left alone.
If the maff is good, it's a waste of time.
Rob

[2HiPsi]

Rob...

Can I use the Maf table much like I would an ICCU?? Scale the #'s by a percentage? Is this a good way of doing it?

[Quick6]

Yes, that is one way of doing it but you have to watch it real close. You'll find yourself "MAXING" the maff table which is 11,500. Once you maff the maff, the pcm reverts to set tables, aka VE table aka speed density. I did on mine real quick so i also tweaked the PE tables. I tried messing with VE but it only made the cars fuel trims and shift points go crazy.

Rob